07-11-2005, 03:51 PM
Dave of Diego Garcia,
What are the chances that you or any boatload of skeptics like you will change the reading of Matthew 28:19 to eliminate the Trinity from it ?
You have offered no evidence that it is wrong.
You claim the disciples baptized differently than the command of Mt 28:19 says. I disagree, but for the sake of argument, lets grant you that they did . Does that mean the command in scripture is wrong, or that the disciples disobeyed it ? You seem to opt right away for the integrity of the apostles and the disintegration of scripture. I would rather believe in the integrity of scripture.
Some rob Peter to pay Paul; you risk robbing Christ to pay Peter ! Hello ! You don't start by attacking scripture Dave, in order to preserve the intergrity of another scripture. You question your interpretation of scripture .That requires humility, something that seems to elude you completely.
Your interpretation does not trump the word of God. You are not God, Dave . Does anyone else see this as the issue out there ? Dave of Diego Garcia is not Christ or The Holy Spirit. He cannot correct God. There is no mss. evidence to support your position.The church father argument has been turned against you, so you choose to ignore it. Now you want to correct scripture with other scripture.
But what meaning does any scripture have for you, Dave ? Maybe there's another scripture that will correct the one's you are using. Is it all a crossword puzzle to you ?
You also made an outrageous claim about another scripture (which you say I don't appeal to) in Matthew 24:35 : Mt 24:35 Heaven and earth will pass away; but my words shall not pass away.
Your response : "This is a prophesy which has not been fulfilled". I believe that is the gist of it.
I am again dumbfounded. I am not even sure what that means. You never responded to my reply to that one, and you claim I don't address your answers.
Our Lord said "My words will not pass away", yet you say they will and they have. Are we supposed to believe you and reject Christ's words ?
I have been laughing for a week straight, Dave. Anyone who takes you seriously is to be pitied. I wonder if you believe your own words.
You also wrote:
What ! The first one here is the only thing you know how to do , Mr. Dave Ploughman blogger. What a hypocrite you are ! I gave you my views extensively. I was not quoting anything except scripture. Then I send a good refutation of Ploughman from the internet and you cry "Foul" ?
Please spare us the dramatics.
Point two is clear as mud. Matthew 28:19 says nothing about "reciting these words when you baptize: In the Name of the Father and The Son and The Holy Spirit." - Literally !
If you want to be literal about it, then read the literal text. Where does it say , "Recite these words when you baptize, ..." ?
Answer me ,Dave. Why don't you answer ? I want scripture (Just a little of your technique thrown in there) .
Point three is mis-stated.
I gave you five others going up to 200 years earlier than Eusebius . You simply lied about that one. Ignatius wrote his epistle AD 110. Others are from AD 150 - still almost 2 centuries prior to Eusebius, and others around AD 200 and AD 265.
Some people may miss the lies. I usually notice .
Once a person resorts to lying, he has revealed his true nature.
Point four :4) State the mound of manuscript evidence surrounding the baptism/trinity formula.
Geesh ! Sorry for stating the obvious ! There is more that a mound. It is a mountain ! The evidence on your side looks like an ant hill!
Talk about making a mountain out of an ant hill.That is what you are trying to do with this issue. You will give it up, because I will expose you for the fraud you are. You cannot win this Dave, because you are a phony and I have nailed you, and I will hammer you with the truth until you run wailing like a little thief caught redhanded in the act and shot in the hand.
Point five: Claim complete inerrancy of the bible.
I am guilty as charged ! No apology offered.
I say you are a liar and a son of The Liar !
And it matters little what you say; you have no credibility with me. Anyone who believes you is as blind as you are.
"And if the blind lead the blind,they will both fall into a pit." Matthew 15:14
And that would be a very deep pit.
Rev. Dave
What are the chances that you or any boatload of skeptics like you will change the reading of Matthew 28:19 to eliminate the Trinity from it ?
You have offered no evidence that it is wrong.
You claim the disciples baptized differently than the command of Mt 28:19 says. I disagree, but for the sake of argument, lets grant you that they did . Does that mean the command in scripture is wrong, or that the disciples disobeyed it ? You seem to opt right away for the integrity of the apostles and the disintegration of scripture. I would rather believe in the integrity of scripture.
Some rob Peter to pay Paul; you risk robbing Christ to pay Peter ! Hello ! You don't start by attacking scripture Dave, in order to preserve the intergrity of another scripture. You question your interpretation of scripture .That requires humility, something that seems to elude you completely.
Your interpretation does not trump the word of God. You are not God, Dave . Does anyone else see this as the issue out there ? Dave of Diego Garcia is not Christ or The Holy Spirit. He cannot correct God. There is no mss. evidence to support your position.The church father argument has been turned against you, so you choose to ignore it. Now you want to correct scripture with other scripture.
But what meaning does any scripture have for you, Dave ? Maybe there's another scripture that will correct the one's you are using. Is it all a crossword puzzle to you ?
You also made an outrageous claim about another scripture (which you say I don't appeal to) in Matthew 24:35 : Mt 24:35 Heaven and earth will pass away; but my words shall not pass away.
Your response : "This is a prophesy which has not been fulfilled". I believe that is the gist of it.
I am again dumbfounded. I am not even sure what that means. You never responded to my reply to that one, and you claim I don't address your answers.
Our Lord said "My words will not pass away", yet you say they will and they have. Are we supposed to believe you and reject Christ's words ?
I have been laughing for a week straight, Dave. Anyone who takes you seriously is to be pitied. I wonder if you believe your own words.
You also wrote:
Quote:He basically did about most of the same things you did Dave,
1) Pick out some scholars, use them to refute for you, hide behind them.
2) Use an "authority" type theory that paints the name of Jesus in a broader sense than just literal terms.
3) Refute the quoted church father(s) with other church father quotes around the same timeframe.
4) State the mound of manuscript evidence surrounding the baptism/trinity formula.
5) Claim complete inerrancy of the bible.
What ! The first one here is the only thing you know how to do , Mr. Dave Ploughman blogger. What a hypocrite you are ! I gave you my views extensively. I was not quoting anything except scripture. Then I send a good refutation of Ploughman from the internet and you cry "Foul" ?
Please spare us the dramatics.
Point two is clear as mud. Matthew 28:19 says nothing about "reciting these words when you baptize: In the Name of the Father and The Son and The Holy Spirit." - Literally !
If you want to be literal about it, then read the literal text. Where does it say , "Recite these words when you baptize, ..." ?
Answer me ,Dave. Why don't you answer ? I want scripture (Just a little of your technique thrown in there) .
Point three is mis-stated.
Quote:other church father quotes around the same timeframe?
I gave you five others going up to 200 years earlier than Eusebius . You simply lied about that one. Ignatius wrote his epistle AD 110. Others are from AD 150 - still almost 2 centuries prior to Eusebius, and others around AD 200 and AD 265.
Some people may miss the lies. I usually notice .
Once a person resorts to lying, he has revealed his true nature.
Point four :4) State the mound of manuscript evidence surrounding the baptism/trinity formula.
Geesh ! Sorry for stating the obvious ! There is more that a mound. It is a mountain ! The evidence on your side looks like an ant hill!
Talk about making a mountain out of an ant hill.That is what you are trying to do with this issue. You will give it up, because I will expose you for the fraud you are. You cannot win this Dave, because you are a phony and I have nailed you, and I will hammer you with the truth until you run wailing like a little thief caught redhanded in the act and shot in the hand.
Point five: Claim complete inerrancy of the bible.
I am guilty as charged ! No apology offered.
I say you are a liar and a son of The Liar !
And it matters little what you say; you have no credibility with me. Anyone who believes you is as blind as you are.
"And if the blind lead the blind,they will both fall into a pit." Matthew 15:14
And that would be a very deep pit.
Rev. Dave
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I also have articles at BibleCodeDigest.com