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Peshitta into English
#1
Is the Lamsa version the only English version of the Peshitta? Thanks!
Jimmy
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#2
No, there are a few. The Lamsa, Etehridge, Murdock, Way International and the best of all:

The Younan <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile -->
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#3
Shlama Jimmy!

You'll find Murdock's and Etheridge's translations at <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.peshitta.com">http://www.peshitta.com</a><!-- w --> You'll see, in the 'James Murdock' column, Introduction, Author, Appendix, Books, and Discussion and in the 'John Wesley Etheridge' column, Introduction, Author, Books, and Discussion.
What will help you a lot is to right-click on 'Books' instead of left-click. I say that because you're given the choice 'Open Link in New Window' and when you left-click on that choice you're free to back up to your original page and repeat the process. The 'Peshito Syriac Version' tab on the home page could be right-clicked also, followed by 'Open Link in New Window' and these javascript popup lexical windows will allow you to see the original words (with the exception of a word or two found in Hebrews 2:9, etc.--bit of a controversy there between Syriac Peshito and Aramaic Peshitta--99.99% of the Peshito reads like the Peshitta ) When in doubt and you need to be absolutely sure everything checks out, then go to the 'Word Docs' on this site. They'll let you know for sure.
I hope you have downloaded Adobe Acrobat because that will help you read the ongoing Peshitta Aramaic-English Interlinear of akhan Paul Younan. <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile -->

Shlama w'Burkate, (Peace and Blessings), Larry Kelsey
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#4
Thanks to all who responded. I will look at the site. Now, which ones are available for purchase and where may I purchase them?
Jimmy
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#5
Jimmy Wrote:Thanks to all who responded. I will look at the site. Now, which ones are available for purchase and where may I purchase them?

Greetings in the name of Yeshua, Jimmy!

Gorgias Press has a copy of James Murdock's translation of the Syriac Peshitto.

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.gorgiaspress.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=GPB&Product_Code=0-9715986-8-1">http://www.gorgiaspress.com/Merchant2/m ... 715986-8-1</a><!-- m -->

John Wesley Etheridge has a two volume work on this webpage:

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://members.aol.com/goodbooks7/Biblical.htm">http://members.aol.com/goodbooks7/Biblical.htm</a><!-- m -->

Etheridge, J. W. The Syrian Churches: Their Early History, Liturgies, and Literature, with a Literal Translation of the Four Gospels, from the Peschito. [and] The Apostolical Acts and Epistles, from the Peschito, or Ancient Syriac. 1846. 2 vols: 547, 522 pp. #1294. $75.

Shlama w'Burkate, Larry Kelsey
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#6
And here you can buy the best, well, what is ready (the Gospels):

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.e-web-presence.com/aramaicbooks/product_info.php?products_id=47&osCsid=621e1162ad055c63860a87b79604819a">http://www.e-web-presence.com/aramaicbo ... b79604819a</a><!-- m -->

It has two five star reviews <!-- sSmile --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/smile.gif" alt="Smile" title="Smile" /><!-- sSmile -->
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#7
Thank you all, again! I will purchse some of these. I have one more question: Am I correct that Lamsa is the only translator who uses "...for this I was spared..." and other Syriac/Aramaic translators agree with the Greek translation "...why hast thou forsaken me...?" Why the difference? Which is correct?
Jimmy
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#8
Jimmy Wrote:Thank you all, again! I will purchse some of these. I have one more question: Am I correct that Lamsa is the only translator who uses "...for this I was spared..." and other Syriac/Aramaic translators agree with the Greek translation "...why hast thou forsaken me...?" Why the difference? Which is correct?

Lamsa mistranslated the Aramaic, where the other translators were influenced by the Greek (as they saw the Greek as authoritative, and if the Greek said it meant "jump" they would use "jump").

The weight of lexical evidence rests upon "why have you allowed me?" (along the reasoning in english: "What reason am I here for?") as I see it :-)

Shlomo,
-Steve-o
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#9
Quote:Lamsa mistranslated the Aramaic, where the other translators were influenced by the Greek (as they saw the Greek as authoritative, and if the Greek said it meant "jump" they would use "jump").

The weight of lexical evidence rests upon "why have you allowed me?" (along the reasoning in english: "What reason am I here for?") as I see it :-)

Shlomo,
-Steve-o

Okay, why would a native Assyrian who was fluent in Aramaic make such a mistake? Will you give me the entire correct translation from Matthew 27:46 from the Peshitta? How much of Lamsa's translation is accurate? Thank you for taking time to help me learn more.
Jimmy
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#10
Jimmy Wrote:
Quote:Lamsa mistranslated the Aramaic, where the other translators were influenced by the Greek (as they saw the Greek as authoritative, and if the Greek said it meant "jump" they would use "jump").

The weight of lexical evidence rests upon "why have you allowed me?" (along the reasoning in english: "What reason am I here for?") as I see it :-)

Shlomo,
-Steve-o

Okay, why would a native Assyrian who was fluent in Aramaic make such a mistake? Will you give me the entire correct translation from Matthew 27:46 from the Peshitta? How much of Lamsa's translation is accurate? Thank you for taking time to help me learn more.

Because he, like everyone else (no one excluded), had an agenda (I hate sounding cynical...). This agenda is very apparent, for example, in his treating of demon posessed figures in scripture (he overruled the supernatural and called them "lunatics") and the hundreds of "idioms" he supposedly recorded when there is no corroborating evidence for them. There were many holes in his work which all of us here are doing our best to patch up, as he is one of the most well known "founders" of the modern movement, but made blunders of such grandeur so much as to make Greek AND Aramaic primacists cry. :-)

"And at about the 9th hour he cried out in a loud voice, "My God! My God! For what [reason] have you allowed me?" if my memory serves me correctly. The root in question "shvaq" (of shvaqtonee, 2nd person masculine singular perfect tense (shvaqth) w/1st person personal pronoun suffix (-onee)) means, in order of most common use in the rest of the Aramaic NT, "to allow, to forgive, to let alone, to leave."

Shlomo,
-Steve-o
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#11
So, have I wasted my time these past 15 years studying Lamsa, Errico and those who agree with them? One more question. Lamsa says "turn the other cheek" means "don't start a fight." This never made sense to me because the person has already been slapped. He hasn't started anything.
Jimmy
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#12
Shlama Jimmy,

It's never a waste of time studying anything (although Errico comes close to being an exception to that rule.)

Lamsa made errors. Everyone does - including yours trooly. Sometimes they were not just simple errors that he made. His personal theology shows up a lot, even at the expense of making the text say something that it doesn't.

Just my 2 cents....
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
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#13
Jimmy Wrote:So, have I wasted my time these past 15 years studying Lamsa, Errico and those who agree with them?

I think Akki Paul put it best :-) Lamsa is not a waste, because he is technically one of the "modern fathers" of the Aramaic primacy movement, if not the most well-known Aramaic primacist to date. His studies, though, were based off of eastern mysticism and personal theology :-P :-(

Quote:One more question. Lamsa says "turn the other cheek" means "don't start a fight." This never made sense to me because the person has already been slapped. He hasn't started anything.

The explanation that I have been given by the professors here at Rutgers has to do with the importance of the right hand in 1st Century social interaction. Even today, most business is done with the right hand, because, for example, in days of olde the left hand was a godsend in a world without toilet paper (I wish I was making this up, I truly wish). HENCE, greetings, and disciplines were done with the right hand.

In order to strike someone on the right cheek, then, as Jesus talked about, the assailant would have to backhand their target. Children and slaves were disciplined in this way, so imagine the social implications of backhanding someone across the right side of their face. Insult and mockery! Turning the other cheek, then (according to my professors) was not a way of rolling over in a fight, but preventing someone from looking down on you. Offering your left cheek would be along the lines of silently saying "Face me like an equal."

It's a very interesting theory, but I don't know the sources from where it came.

Shlomo,
-Steve-o
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