09-20-2003, 06:05 PM
Luke 7:45 split verb: ???LT.
Shlama!
Today???s Mass Gospel was Lk 7:36-50 (The sinful woman in Simon the Pharisee house). As usually --since I became a ???Peshitta-holic???--, while preparing my sermon, I consulted the Peshitta and I found this interesting issue in v. 45:
(For you) KJV: ...but this woman since the time I came in hath not ceased...
Greek NA27 ???canonized??? text:
...But this (woman) since SHE entered (SHE) didn???t stop...
autj de afhjv eisjlqon ou dielipen
The variant:
L* f1.13 al lat (some latins) SyP SyH Sa(mss) bo (pt)
...But this (woman) since I entered (she) didn???t stop...
autj de afhjv eisjlqen ou dielipen
Let???s see now the Peshitta Text:
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]...tyl4 f tl9d Nm 0h Nyd 0dh[/font]
It???s all about the verb[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] l9 [/font] (to enter). Notice that both FIRST (common) and THIRD FEMENINE (and also 2nd Masculine, but it isn???t relevant here) persons of the singular Perfect Peal, [font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] tl9 [/font], WITHOUT VOWELS ARE THE SAME!
So, in this case:
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tle9 [/font] (???alth) = You (m) entered
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]telO9 [/font] (???elath) = She entered
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tOlO9 [/font] (???eleth) = I entered
Therefore, this could confuse Zorba, poor fellow. ANOTHER PROVE OF THE ARAMAIC PRIORITY!
However................... <!-- s:bigups: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/bigups.gif" alt=":bigups:" title="Big Ups" /><!-- s:bigups: -->
Let???s consider it again without ???passion???: In this particular case, I would think that the translation ???3rd fem??? would be MORE LOGICAL:
1. The woman???s action seems having started certain time AFTER Maran Eshoa entered to Simon???s house. Both ???entrances??? shouldn???t be necessarily simultaneous (as the ???1st person??? choice seems to express).
2. The continuity of actions in 3rd person: ???since SHE entered (SHE) didn???t stop...???
3. The ???1st person??? choice could be influenced by previous v. 44 ([font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tl9 <tybl [/font] ???...I entered in your house???).
4. In any case, the FULL MEANING of the tale remains intact, since the statement here, after all, is Maran Eshoa???s attitude toward the woman because of her behavior in contrast with Simon???s, leading to the micro-parable about ???Debts and Love??? and final crucial sentence about ???FAITH-THAT-MAKES-LIVE??? (Oh, I love Aramaic!).
5. The most important, from the p.of.v. of the Forum, and I insist on it: This variant --IN TRANSLATION, based on a different VOCALIZATION--, actually didn???t contradict Aramaic Priority at all (you correct me if I???m wrong). As our Elder Brothers the Jews who consider not the Masoretic vowels but the Consonantal Text as sacred, I guess that for Aramaic believers is the Peshitta Text consonants and not vowels (written afterward, of ???relative value???, then) that is considered absolutely sacred and inspired. It might be then a matter of vowels??? alternative...
Thoughts? <!-- s:lookround: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/lookround.gif" alt=":lookround:" title="Look Round" /><!-- s:lookround: -->
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] 0ml4 Jwklkl 0whn [/font]
Ab. Valentin
Shlama!
Today???s Mass Gospel was Lk 7:36-50 (The sinful woman in Simon the Pharisee house). As usually --since I became a ???Peshitta-holic???--, while preparing my sermon, I consulted the Peshitta and I found this interesting issue in v. 45:
(For you) KJV: ...but this woman since the time I came in hath not ceased...
Greek NA27 ???canonized??? text:
...But this (woman) since SHE entered (SHE) didn???t stop...
autj de afhjv eisjlqon ou dielipen
The variant:
L* f1.13 al lat (some latins) SyP SyH Sa(mss) bo (pt)
...But this (woman) since I entered (she) didn???t stop...
autj de afhjv eisjlqen ou dielipen
Let???s see now the Peshitta Text:
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]...tyl4 f tl9d Nm 0h Nyd 0dh[/font]
It???s all about the verb[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] l9 [/font] (to enter). Notice that both FIRST (common) and THIRD FEMENINE (and also 2nd Masculine, but it isn???t relevant here) persons of the singular Perfect Peal, [font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] tl9 [/font], WITHOUT VOWELS ARE THE SAME!
So, in this case:
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tle9 [/font] (???alth) = You (m) entered
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]telO9 [/font] (???elath) = She entered
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tOlO9 [/font] (???eleth) = I entered
Therefore, this could confuse Zorba, poor fellow. ANOTHER PROVE OF THE ARAMAIC PRIORITY!
However................... <!-- s:bigups: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/bigups.gif" alt=":bigups:" title="Big Ups" /><!-- s:bigups: -->
Let???s consider it again without ???passion???: In this particular case, I would think that the translation ???3rd fem??? would be MORE LOGICAL:
1. The woman???s action seems having started certain time AFTER Maran Eshoa entered to Simon???s house. Both ???entrances??? shouldn???t be necessarily simultaneous (as the ???1st person??? choice seems to express).
2. The continuity of actions in 3rd person: ???since SHE entered (SHE) didn???t stop...???
3. The ???1st person??? choice could be influenced by previous v. 44 ([font=Estrangelo (V1.1)]tl9 <tybl [/font] ???...I entered in your house???).
4. In any case, the FULL MEANING of the tale remains intact, since the statement here, after all, is Maran Eshoa???s attitude toward the woman because of her behavior in contrast with Simon???s, leading to the micro-parable about ???Debts and Love??? and final crucial sentence about ???FAITH-THAT-MAKES-LIVE??? (Oh, I love Aramaic!).
5. The most important, from the p.of.v. of the Forum, and I insist on it: This variant --IN TRANSLATION, based on a different VOCALIZATION--, actually didn???t contradict Aramaic Priority at all (you correct me if I???m wrong). As our Elder Brothers the Jews who consider not the Masoretic vowels but the Consonantal Text as sacred, I guess that for Aramaic believers is the Peshitta Text consonants and not vowels (written afterward, of ???relative value???, then) that is considered absolutely sacred and inspired. It might be then a matter of vowels??? alternative...
Thoughts? <!-- s:lookround: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/lookround.gif" alt=":lookround:" title="Look Round" /><!-- s:lookround: -->
[font=Estrangelo (V1.1)] 0ml4 Jwklkl 0whn [/font]
Ab. Valentin