Setting the record straight

[Christina]

Where is your source about "public domain cannot be plagiarized?"

Common sense.

The claim that public domain cannot be plagiarized is simply false, and only a thief and a fraud would take someone else's translation(s) and put his name on it and sell it as his own translation. What you are saying is that I could republish Lamsa' s 1933 translation with my name on it and sell it with impunity. This is essentially what Andrew has done.

Lamsa's translation is still under copyright <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/sleepy.gif" alt="" title="Sleepy" /><!-- s -->

If a public domain work can be plagiarized then how can it be a public domain work? Can you not see the absurdity of this statement? This is nonsense when you look at it from the original author's point of view, which Paul has already testified. Murdock is dead, and I doubt he's turning in his grave over this, though you're free to ask him at the resurrection. As for Paul's work, it is for Paul to decide whether Andrew has plagiarized his work or not, AND HE HAS DECIDED THAT HE HASN'T - HOW THE HELL CAN YOU STILL NOT UNDERSTAND THIS???

The issue is not public domain, nor is it getting permission from Paul Younan (who says never translated anything from the NT anyway); it is about "proper attribution"- giving proper credit to the real authors, for the translation (not the notes, which is another topic, as far as I am concerned.)

PAUL HAS SAID THAT ANDREW DIDN'T NEED TO GIVE HIM CREDIT!!! WHO ARE YOU TO DICTATE TO PAUL HOW ANDREW SHOULD GIVE PROPER ATTRIBUTION TO HIM - IT'S PAUL'S WORK (WHICH ANDREW HAD A HAND IN ANYWAY) NOT YOURS - SO IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU.

You, Albion & Ryan are claiming that Andrew plagiarized Paul, and that Paul is CYAing Andrew's plagiarism of his own work, and at the same time saying that Paul's permission doesn't count??? Honestly, I HAVE NEVER HEARD ANYTHING MORE STUPID IN MY ENTIRE LIFE!!!

Forget the arguments of all posts on this thread - COMMON SENSE ITSELF COMPLETELY DESTROYS YOUR ARGUMENT.

He still has not told us how much of the work is original to him, and told Albion, "I don't like your tone" for even asking the question. Now Albion is banned for it.

What is this, the Grand Inquistion of Rome? If someone dares to question the great Andrew Gabriel Roth, he is excommunicated? I see nothing but corruption and lies being perpetrated here to protect Andrew Roth from his own sins.

He refused to answer the question.

For the record I'm not the moderator who banned Albion, neither was it Andrew or Paul, it was Abudar. I didn't have a problem with Albion's questions, I had a problem with his attitude, but that wasn't the reason for my proposal to have him banned, it was because Albion insulted Paul and his church:

Paul Younan will coddle satanic demonized hackers, and attack me, and CENSOR me, because we have very different understandings of what the word FREEDOM implies.

It's no wonder that the Assyrian Church of the East was submerged under radical Islam, if THIS is any indication of it's spiritual leadership!

That is absolutely cheap and low, and completely unacceptable and inexcusable <!-- s:angry: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/angry.gif" alt=":angry:" title="Angry" /><!-- s:angry: --> <!-- s:mad: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/mad.gif" alt=":mad:" title="Mad" /><!-- s:mad: --> <!-- s:angry: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/angry.gif" alt=":angry:" title="Angry" /><!-- s:angry: --> <!-- s:mad: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/mad.gif" alt=":mad:" title="Mad" /><!-- s:mad: --> and you deserve to be banned for it! Moderators: should we ban him for good? I vote yes, cast your votes.

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THIS IS AGAINST THE FORUM RULES, READ IT FOR YOURSELF:

The Peshitta.org Forum is a monitored forum. In an effort to make this forum as useful and as constructive as possible, any threatening, abusive, libelous, or defamatory information of any kind posted here will be removed. Personal insults or insults toward any community will not be tolerated and the entire post will be summarily removed, along with its replies...

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Albion also insulted Thirdwoe by calling him "a kid who knows nothing":

"Thirdwoe", people like you know nothing. Your a KID, for Messiah's sake. What do you know?

"Fawning" isn't wanting the BEST, it's kissing up to someone's backside. I wanted the BEST, and I prayed fervently for it. Oh well. Our BEST CHANCE for a real Eastern version of the Peshitta is NOW GONE.

If you weren't just trying to hurt me with your words, you'd wake up, and actually REALIZE THAT. But as I said, your just a kid.

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These are the details that Ryan left out of his comment on amazon (out of convenience?).

And Albion blatantly lied when he said this:

I DID contact BOTH Andrew AND Baruch IN PRIVATE. It did absolutely NO GOOD.

You've been wanting to ban me since you got "the power" Christina. Go head, DON'T THREATEN.......do it!

Time will PROVE ME RIGHT. Wait and SEE. This is another HRV deal, and we ALL got screwed. PERIOD.

Considering all of THE HATE for me on this list (generated by "Corvus Argentum", Latin for "Crow, Silver") WHY WOULD I USE *MY REAL NAME*? I mean duhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! Stupid IS, as stupid DOES. (Forrest Gump)

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I never threatened to ban Albion since the day I became a moderator, I received my moderator's control panel AFTER Albion left the forum voluntarily, in fact these were Albion's last words the day he voluntarily left the forum:

I can't be a member of this forum any longer.

I will certainly miss my friends: Andrew Gabriel Roth, Ryan, And Christina. I was beginning to get to know Phil, and I'm sorry that that will be interrupted now.

I wish nothing but the BEST for this Forum, and I know that it will continue to thrive and grow. I have certainly learned A LOT while I was here, and from everybody that I learned from, THANK YOU!

I leave knowing that my Brother Andrew got immersed at the Church of the East...........I just think that that is the coolest thing!

To my Dear Friends, thank each one of you for being my friend......you KNOW that I will miss you. I'll continue to read here from time-to-time, but my days of writing are over, I was surely never that great of a writer anyways!

Thanks again for letting me share Matthew's Gospel Andrew! I WAS and still AM HONORED!

Christina, you'll make a GREAT MODERATOR!

Ryan, you and I can still talk, as always.

GOODBYE MY FRIENDS.

Albion

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What I find amazing is how you and Ryan cannot see Albion's blindingly obvious self-centeredness:

To Nick D.,

Dear Nick,

*I* was/am "the inquirer" that Ryan so courageously mentions here.

It was I who ANDREW CHOSE to release his first Book (Matthew's Gospel) of the AENT to the public through my review.

He (Andrew Gabriel Roth) sent me a PDF file of 'Matthew's Gospel' from MARI (P.E.A.C.E.)......this is what we ALL used to call the book that is now known as the AENT.

Anyway, Andrew chose me to release the PDF of Matthew's Gospel as a preview of his soon coming New Testament, to <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.peshitta.org">http://www.peshitta.org</a><!-- m -->, which I gladly DID...

Albion seems to think that the entire universe revolves around him, that the AENT was made exclusively for him, this is obvious in his continuous nagging in the days leading up to the AENT's release: <!-- l --><a class="postlink-local" href="http://www.peshitta.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1708&p=10400">viewtopic.php?f=17&t=1708&p=10400</a><!-- l -->

And as for Ryan quoting me out of context:

"Has the so-called `truth' committee been sent a warning? That's usually what I do before I ban a user ... Otherwise rules are rules, such posts are to be removed ... let's send him a warning if he posts again, though he might not come back now that we know who he is". (a moderator who spoke w/o even owning a copy of AENT)

It's true that I didn't own a copy of AENT at the time (I do now) but I specifically said that I based my judgment on Otto's review:

You, and everyone here, should be sitting in shiva, over this particular issue.

But you don't have enough spiritual sense and understanding to do this.

Really? Akhan Otto didn't seem to have a problem with Mari and he knows a thing two about the Peshitta, so I think I'm gonna go with his judgement. And I remember that you were lucky enough to see the pre-published Mari Matthew and you raved about it. I get the feeling that this isn't about Andrew or Mari, but it's actually about you!

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Here's Otto's review:

Wow! I am delighted and overwhelmed to have a copy of Andrew Roth's ARAMAIC ENGLISH NEW TESTAMENT, Netzari Press, 2008.

Andrew has distilled the Peshitta + FIVE into a perfectly balanced English translation that maintains the semitic foundations without confusing the reader. Also, he has deftly incorporated his rational interpretation of many ideas kicked around in this forum and balanced them with good judgement. The Appendix is an intellectual gold mine. This is the Aramaic primacy book for true scholars!

I think everyone who supports Aramaic primacy should purchase an extra copy and donate it to his or her favorite University Library to spread this knowledge to young students as well as old professors.

Thank you, Andrew, for your brilliant hard work and this great gift. God Bless You!

Sincerely,

Otto

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Otto is a real Semitic scholar who knows what he's talking about and I will trust his judgment over Albion's any day!

BTW can you please admit to Ryan that you are not a real "Aramaic, Greek and Hebrew scholar" as he claims by your own admissions on this forum? And that you haven't earned the title of "Reverend" as he claims? Not only because of your ungodly behavior but also because you yourself have admitted that you have been thrown out of several churches, and that most churches consider your Christological views heretical:

I have paid a price for my beliefs and been rejected by several churches after preaching the word for a time. My position has been hammered out on the anvil of trial and opposition and forged in heaven. I cannot deny what God has revealed to me and proven in the lab of life. I have seen Him and heard his voice. I cannot go back.

I SEE, SO YOU DO WISH TO BE A CULTIC LEADER. ONLY YOUR REVELATION IS CORRECT. THANKS FOR COMING THEN TO ENLIGHTEN US. DON'T LET THE SCREEN DOOR HIT YOU ON THE WAY OUT.

Shlama Akhi Dave,

Firstly, "Burkate" is spelled with a Kaph, not a Khet! <!-- s:crazy: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/crazy.gif" alt=":crazy:" title="Crazy" /><!-- s:crazy: --> Secondly, you have no place telling anyone what Qnoma means if you can't even spell an Aramaic word properly!

Thirdly, it does not come as that big of a surprise to me that you've been rejected by several churches. No Orthodox Christian would tolerate your Eutychian sympathies. This heresy is condemned by all churches that I know of (including the CoE, SOC and RCC.)

...You stated that the "Incarnation means that God became man" - that's pure heresy, condemned at Chalcedon and other synods in the Eastern Church as well. This matter was settled a long time ago.

The Incarnation does NOT mean that God changed into anything. God remained God, and simply took the form of a servant by taking a temple of humanity from Mary. His Divinity dwelled within the humanity with which He clothed Himself.

It is this humanity that was tempted in the wilderness, that urinated, that defecated, that ate food, that drank water, that bled on the Cross and that lay dead in the tomb for three days and three nights. God was not involved in any of those things. God is impassible, eternal and in need of none of those things.

You, sir, worship a "god-man" in the Greek pagan tradition. Orthodox Christianity worships a "God and Man" - there is a BIG difference between the two.

That is the Orthodox definition of the Incarnation - anything else is heresy (and should be kicked out of any church!)...

Akha Paul,

Thankyou for correcting my spelling; I hate incorrect spelling in any language; I admit I am not an expert in Aramaic; I am quite good at NT Greek and French; Hebrew to a lesser extent.

Yes , I am a heretic, by most Church Council standards; I hope to die a heretic. I would very disappointed in myself if I don't. I want to follow Him who said, "Take up your cross and follow Me." "If the world hated me , it will hate you also." "Woe to you when all speak well of you; blessed are ye when men shall hate you, persecute you and speak all manner of evil against you, falsely for my sake..."

All I have done was to express my position and now I am told, "Don't let the door hit you on the way out."

Andrew seems a bit sensitive and thin skinned. That's OK, I can take banishment; I would rejoice all the more for Christ's sake.

I may be mistaken about some things; I have been wrong before; I am honest about what I believe and constantly ask The Father for His guidance and wisdom, and implicitly believe in His word.

I have found that many who profess faith in Christ and God have never known either in a personal sense. Doctrine and works of righteousness which we have done can never save us- only being born of the Spirit from above can do that.

I say you are ignorant of God; I say Andrew is ignorant of God. I will trust your future salvation to Him. He has made provision for it and for all men in His own time.

I wish you well; I will not post any more; You may remove my forum and posts if you wish. I do not sense any liberty with you guys; I sense a sectarian legalism and censorship of speech and ideas. God's spirit cannot abide in such a mind.

You would persecute The Son of Man if he were in the flesh on earth today; indeed , He is in the flesh on earth today and you do persecute Him as did the Scribes and Pharisees of the first century.
Yes , you persecute Him for telling you the truth of God and challenging your false doctrine.

I know you will ridicule me even more for writing these words and mock me for them.

You might take pause before you do so, if you believe the words, "He that receives him that I send receives me; He that rejects him that I send, rejects Me also."

All the best followers of Christ are heretics and fools; They are His representatives , as He died as a heretic and fool.
Beware what you do to us; If Satan has his way, you will let your hate possess you and go on a full fledged attack against God in the name of your religion, as did Saul of Tarsus.

Perhaps that is the best way; perhaps you will meet him on the road to Damascus when He knocks you off your high horse and gives you the blinding light of His presence and truth.


Of course, I may be crazy, as you think; but what if I am right ? Jesus was thought to be crazy by His brothers; Paul was thought mad by Festus.I also have the Spirit of God;

If you believe I am a heretic and deceiver, say out loud that I am a child of Satan, and see what happens to you.

Amen & Amen


Dave B

Shlama Akhi Dave,

...please spare me the "Christ was persecuted, I think am persecuted, therefore I must be right and you must be wrong" poppycock. There have been millions of nutcases (like Koresh) who have tried the exact same logic.

You don't know what persecution is until you've at gazed at a scar on your grandfather's neck that stretched from ear to ear. Then you can tell me about persecution.

I don't care whether you're a "heretic" or not. Up until a few years ago, we were "heretics" (according to the Western Church.) That all of a sudden changed because they admitted that they "misunderstood" us.

I care when someone pretends to teach me about something they know very little about, about which I know alot. First, learn how to properly spell in Aramaic and then you can get into the deeper subjects, like word imagery.

Right now, your method of declaring the imagery of Aramaic words by comparing them to your KJV is a downright shame and a disservice to yourself and others...

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There you go Ryan, it's up there there in red and bold, it is Bauscher NOT Andrew who is "claiming to be something he's not".

Anyway I'm done with you, the other moderators can decide what to do about your posts Dave, though the thought of banning you is starting get very tempting indeed, especially after you called us "brainless sheep".

And I'll say this for the last time: Andrew is not guilty of plagiarism - TELIA KE PAVLA!!!