10-02-2008, 12:12 AM
Shalom,
I originally wanted to post it in the Mistranslations section but it seems like whenever I try to approach it I'm too tired to dig deep and check everything so I thought that will check some grammar with others here.
Here we go:
1Peter 4:1 If then the Messiah hath suffered for you in the flesh, do ye also arm yourselves with the same mind: for every one that is dead in his body, hath ceased from all sins, [Murdock]
1Peter 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; [KJV, and all other Greek-text based English translations]
Can you see the difference ?
The Greek word for "suffer" for the phrase in bold above is "pathon", which is II Aoristus Active Participium of "pascho" - suffer, endure. Vulgata has it as "qui passus est carne", i.e. "whose body has passed (or endured)" (my own poor translation), passus here is from "patior" (from which also English "patience" comes, I believe).
Aramaic has there "dmoet", a form of "mwt" which is "dead" or "dying". Here is my little grammar question now - how are you reading Aramaic here - is it "dead" or rather "dying"?
Note that Peshitta is simpler (!) and makes much more sense in the wider context - yes, "if you are dead you do not sin".
Thanks in advance for any help,
Jerzy
[edited one sentence to clarify what I am looking for]
I originally wanted to post it in the Mistranslations section but it seems like whenever I try to approach it I'm too tired to dig deep and check everything so I thought that will check some grammar with others here.
Here we go:
1Peter 4:1 If then the Messiah hath suffered for you in the flesh, do ye also arm yourselves with the same mind: for every one that is dead in his body, hath ceased from all sins, [Murdock]
1Peter 4:1 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; [KJV, and all other Greek-text based English translations]
Can you see the difference ?
The Greek word for "suffer" for the phrase in bold above is "pathon", which is II Aoristus Active Participium of "pascho" - suffer, endure. Vulgata has it as "qui passus est carne", i.e. "whose body has passed (or endured)" (my own poor translation), passus here is from "patior" (from which also English "patience" comes, I believe).
Aramaic has there "dmoet", a form of "mwt" which is "dead" or "dying". Here is my little grammar question now - how are you reading Aramaic here - is it "dead" or rather "dying"?
Note that Peshitta is simpler (!) and makes much more sense in the wider context - yes, "if you are dead you do not sin".
Thanks in advance for any help,
Jerzy
[edited one sentence to clarify what I am looking for]