Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Lord and God
#16
Dear Markt,

I'm always interested in speaking with Kodesh Namers.

So, I've got a few questions that I'd like to ask you.

Is English your native tongue?

If not, where did you learn to speak Hebrew?

If Hebrew is your native tongue, do you use such common Israeli words such as "abba"?

If you attend a Shul, is it Orthodox, Conservative, Reform, or Liberal?

Are you using the "Sacred Name" in your Shul?

Are you an American, and is English your native tongue, if so, where did you learn to speak Hebrew?

Do you feel that there is ANY Modern version of Hebrew that is free of 'loan words' that are borrowed from other languages?

What first brought you into The Sacred Name Movement?

How long have you been involved with this Movement?

I'm interested in what you actually call The Son of YHWH?

Could you please answer these questions for me?

And if you have Hebrew fonts on your computer could you please write a simple sentence of your choice in Biblical Hebrew.

Something simple like: "My name is Markt, and I'm (your age) years old, and I've studied Hebrew for five years (or however long it has been)".

Thank you for answering my questions, and I very much appreciate your time and your energy.

Shlama/ Shalom, Albion
Reply
#17
dearest brother Albion,

As you know, I am not qualified to post anything that may add to, or enhance the discussion, in regard to the mechanics of translational liguistics on Peshitta.org.

Next to time spend with YHWH in living out Torah, the close relationship I have with my family, Pehitta.org is the highest priority I have in regard to any Internet use.

I would like to lovingly express my concern on where your line of questions to MarkT is leading this thread ... it is possible that no good will come from what you are asking.

I do not know Markt, and my post is not about personalities, my post is about continuing the excellent discussion todate that has been developing around things that we ALL hold as kodesh kodesh.

Any of us whom are registered users of this forum, do NOT have to type out a sentence in hebrew [or aramaic] to prove to anyone, that we are qualified to use YHWH's kodesh name or have our halacha in a Netzarim lifestyle and understanding.

I personally cannot do this, ... my ability to write either hebrew or aramaic clearly is almost non existent.
But ... it does not stop me from living out my life in a halacha that for ME, IS clearly defined in the Scriptures, and I hope is pleasing to Abba YHWH

I have really enjoyed the discussion that you have brought to many topics in the P.o forum over the past weeks.
I just don't think this line of questions is going to enhance the development of this thread, and the issues that YOU are addressing.
It is this kind of post that makes people like me very reticent to either ask questions or post contributions to this forum.

Baruch haShem YHWH
Gordon
Reply
#18
Dear Gordon,

I'm really glad that you wrote and expressed your heart.

My intention was good, but perhaps I expressed myself in a way that was hurtful to other people on the board.

I'm really sorry if that is the case.

Let me just say that I Love this Forum, like you do, but I've been fighting with a ghost (let the reader understand), and the last few days, my emotions have sometimes outrun my intellect.

Markt, I apologize if my post hurt you, or was just unkind in anyway.

There's stuff going on in my life that requires me to almost walk a spiritual tightrope lately, when what I wanna do is solve it all, the way things get solved in in a lot of American movies.

That doesn't make my short sightedness right, or justify it in anyway, but at least you are aware of my plight.

Gordon, if one knows the score, one can sing along, or try as much as possible to change things too.

I would encourage you to do the later. Thanks so much for your 'heads up'.

This spiritual warfare is wearing me thin (I always wanted to lose weight, but NOT this way!).

Peace inspite of war.

Tenderness weighs more than hate.

In Messiah, Albion
Reply
#19
Dearest brother and sisters, Gordon has stated things the way I see them. Thanks Gordon. Albion, we all have our journeys to make and we are all I'm sure, pointing in the same direction maintaining our lives in Ruach Kodesh of YHWH. Unfortunately, Paul Younans' replies to me (selective) have been generally neutral except for a few. Namely the most recent one on this thread. Paul, if you come from a secondary or primary school teaching background then I can relate to the way you reply (often belittling). If you are not from this background then please desist for the cause of this thread. My questions have been strictly according to forum rules (although we all have our theologies)! To quote you a number of occasions "if you are looking for a sabbath resurrection"...
Paul, (by the way) in your speech on Aramaic Primacy, I just read it on the net (Sept 1st, 2001), you have made a dire mistake when referring to the language of my country as Maori. It is English. The Maori language has taken on the written form over the last 50 or so years and is now recognised as a 'second' or native official language of this country.
Moving on, Albion, I don't see the benefit of answering your questions because of the direction of this thread except to say that I have read about the Sacred Name Movement but that's all. My biblical hermeneutics has lead me to persue the meanings conveyed in the ancient languages. Writers like Nehemia Gordon, Andrew Gabriel Roth (and others) have given me huge insights into these otherwise 'glossed over' and hidden meanings.I am about to start on the book by Andrew "The Path to Life".
Coming from the hermeneutical perspective I always see red (alarm bells) when translators render words in the English language which clearly are of PAGAN origin. e.g. Lord, God, Easter, Sunday. And false expressions of otherwise transliterated words (nouns) Jehovah, Jesus, Bishop, Deacon.
Please don't take this personally (depending on your listening or belief system), there is enough truth and teaching on this subject which has been around for a very long time. In the words of Revelations "Come out of her My people".
Paul, in order to warp up the answer to my original question, if the Aramaic Peshitta writes the Creators Name as MarYah (and you say substituting is ok) then what gives the writer the permission to do so?

Shalom in Yeshua,

Mark
Reply
#20
Mark, I'm done with you - please don't ask me any more questions. You may direct any inquiry to other members of the board and you are more than welcome to participate fully in this forum, but please do not involve me. I don't have time for these games.

Regards,
+Shamasha Paul
Reply
#21
Mark,

Nehemia Gordon is NOT a Believer in Yeshua.

I liked his book, but he IS STILL NOT A BELIEVER IN YESHUA.

And there is NOT but ONE Revelation.

It troubles me some as I KNOW that Andrew Gabriel Roth is a Biblical Scholar and we now have people appealing to his books, that don't seem to know, or perhaps don't seem to LIKE what the Bible says, or the way in which The Bible says it.

While Andrew is a Nazarene, I believe that he would have given you answers that are quite similar to Paul Younan's.

If I understand you, you seem to think that the P'shitta New Covenant should translate the Sacred Name in HEBREW is that right?

I'm just trying to get straight on what your stand is here.

Shlama, Albion
Reply
#22
Paul, I guess, at the end of the day, it is YOUR translation. The questions I was asking were purely coming from a translator/linguists perspective.
The fact is, my questions (many) have been unanswered. For whatever reason, you have deemed to make personal attacks (this belongs in the realm of ...) Yes, there is much content which does not line up theologically, i.e. use of pagan words and titles. I pray, sincerely, that you change the way you relate to people who have genuine questions about the authenticity of the Peshitta and YOUR translation/interpretation of it.
It is pointless for me to continue so I will leave it all at that. Thank you to those who corresponded in the Ruach.

Albion, Nehemia as far as I know is not a believer in Messiah, let's pray for a revelation here, that he comes into a realisation. I never intentioned anything by quoting him except to say he uses the Names.
You asked me if the Peshitta New Covenant should translate the sacred Name in Hebrew?
FirstIy, it does not matter what we think, it matters that if the Name is not transliterated (in the case of the translation here) it is as Paul Younan states, 'substituted'. In other words, IF the Peshitta does not carry the original Hebrew Name as given to Moshe, then it is questionable as to its' authenticity.
Secondly, my question to Paul regarding the use of Lord and God was why use these when the Hebrew equivalent (transliteration) was there in the first place? To use these words, for example, to my horror, I have just found that the Aramaic to English translation of Mattai 16:18 the translator uses another pagan word "CHURCH'. This word and it's Hebrew equivalent (if you could even state such a thing) is diametrically opposed in meaning and intent. Why use it? Unless the translator is coming from a preconceived doctrinal or religious background. Let the reader be aware! This rendition of the this Peshitta serves no good to those looking for the real truth, please do not be offended.

Once again, thank you to those who have engaged in my thread(s).

Shalom,

Mark
P.S. You can look me up on <!-- w --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.called.co.nz">http://www.called.co.nz</a><!-- w --> soon and you are welcome to air your views provided like in all things, it is done in love.
Reply
#23
Akhan Mark,

When you arrive in the Kingdom of Heaven, you may personally ask the authors of the NT why they chose not to transliterate the Hebrew name of God into the Aramaic NT. Like I stated several times, the tradition was well established that in Aramaic, the name of God was not transliterated. EVER. It could have easily been done, but people chose not to do it for a variety of reasons.

If the NT was penned in Hebrew, I would expect to see YHWH there. But it wasn't. It was penned in Aramaic, so I would expect to see MarYah there.

If that, for whatever reason, casts doubt, to you, as to the authenticity of the Aramaic NT, then so be it - I really couldn't care less to tell you the truth. Your opinion means nothing to me.

Like I said, I have nothing further to add.

Every once in a while we get a noob on this forum who thinks he knows everything when in fact he doesn't know squat. You've been nothing but combative and annoying since your arrival here, everything from a Sabbath resurrection, to now this YHWH issue.

It's obvious you have an agenda, one would have to be blind not to see it in your writing. If the Aramaic scriptures disappoint you, there is an easy solution - hit the back button on your browser and go to a forum that studies the Hebrew Names Version or any other "Hebrew" NT that's derived from the KJV. It will make you feel real good that "YHWH" is written there - perhaps lending some "authenticity" to that version.

Sheesh. Look at what we have to deal with around here. I guarantee you that for as long as this forum is up, we will get the occasional "mark" who comes in with the "but, uh, why don't you gather on the Sabbath, clean your hands before you eat, and why do you not wear a kuppah - and what's with the MarYah thing?" <!-- s:crazy: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/crazy.gif" alt=":crazy:" title="Crazy" /><!-- s:crazy: -->

+Shamasha Paul
Reply
#24
Paul Younan Wrote:When you arrive in the Kingdom of Heaven, you may personally ask the authors of the NT why they chose not to transliterate the Hebrew name of God into the Aramaic NT. Like I stated several times, the tradition was well established that in Aramaic, the name of God was not transliterated. EVER. It could have easily been done, but people chose not to do it for a variety of reasons.

If the NT was penned in Hebrew, I would expect to see YHWH there. But it wasn't. It was penned in Aramaic, so I would expect to see MarYah there.

+Shamasha Paul

Hi Paul

Are you saying MarkYah is the same word as Alaha in Aramaic or Allah in Arabic?

In the OT God is known as Jehovah or Yahweh. In the New Testament, God is known as Lord Yeshua. So Yeshua have to show Himself that His Father is God of Abraham. Then for Aramaic, does MarkYah show that it is associated with Yahweh in any way? How to prove that MarkYah is the same God of Abraham?

What is the Holy Name of God in Aramaic? I read Aloha, Alaha, MarkYah and also Allah in Arabic. It is so confusing and it seems that I am heading for the wrong book Peshitta Aramai primacy. What do you think?
Reply
#25
Shalom Positron,

positron Wrote:Are you saying MarkYah is the same word as Alaha in Aramaic or Allah in Arabic?

No. Firstly, it's MarYah not MarkYah. Mar = Lord and Yah = the Name of God. "Mar-Yah". It's a title in Aramaic used exclusively for YHWH.

positron Wrote:In the OT God is known as Jehovah or Yahweh.

No. In the OT God is not known as Jehovah or Yahweh. He is known as YHWH, with no vowel points. No one knows how to pronounce the name, and anyone who tells you otherwise is a liar.

positron Wrote:In the New Testament, God is known as Lord Yeshua.

No, God is not known as Lord Yeshua. Not in the New Testament nor in the Old Testament.

positron Wrote:So Yeshua have to show Himself that His Father is God of Abraham.

Yes.

positron Wrote:Then for Aramaic, does MarkYah show that it is associated with Yahweh in any way? How to prove that MarkYah is the same God of Abraham?

Mar-Yah is a title, it's not a personal name. My cousin is a sheriff. That's his title. His name is Joe. We call him Sheriff Joe. One word is a title, the other is a name. I am a deacon. Some people call me Deacon, a title. Others call me Paul. One is my personal name, the other is a title people use to refer to me.

Mar-Yah contains an abbreviated form of the NAME of YHWH, as found in the Psalms. It's a title, again. It's not meant to replace the personal Name of YHWH.

positron Wrote:What is the Holy Name of God in Aramaic?

The Holy Name of God is YHWH in Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek, English and Swahili. There is only one Name of God, and the language is Hebrew. There is no other name in any other language. Only titles. Maryah is a title, not a name. God is a title, not a name. Alaha is a title, not a name. Allah is a title, not a name. Elohim is a title, not a name.

positron Wrote:I read Aloha, Alaha, MarkYah and also Allah in Arabic. It is so confusing and it seems that I am heading for the wrong book Peshitta Aramai primacy. What do you think?

Aloha? Where are we, Hawaii? <!-- s:biggrin: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/biggrin.gif" alt=":biggrin:" title="Big Grin" /><!-- s:biggrin: -->

Just keep it simple Akhi Positron, there is only one NAME - YHWH.

We do not write that Name in Aramaic, it's only written in Hebrew.

In Aramaic, we write only titles. Like "Alaha" (generic for God) or "MarYah" (specific for YHWH)

Hope that helps!
+Shamasha Paul
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
Reply
#26
markt Wrote:. Unfortunately, Paul Younans' replies to me (selective) have been generally neutral except for a few. Namely the most recent one on this thread. Paul, if you come from a secondary or primary school teaching background then I can relate to the way you reply (often belittling). If you are not from this background then please desist for the cause of this thread.

Mark , please just get over it.
Paul took time and answered your questions. For some reason you kept going on and on.

As for the "cause of the thread"..Paul's comments were the highlight.
Reply
#27
Paul Younan Wrote:No. In the OT God is not known as Jehovah or Yahweh. He is known as YHWH, with no vowel points. No one knows how to pronounce the name, and anyone who tells you otherwise is a liar.

There is only one Name of God, and the language is Hebrew. There is no other name in any other language. Only titles. Maryah is a title, not a name. God is a title, not a name. Alaha is a title, not a name. Allah is a title, not a name. Elohim is a title, not a name.

Just keep it simple Akhi Positron, there is only one NAME - YHWH.

We do not write that Name in Aramaic, it's only written in Hebrew.

In Aramaic, we write only titles. Like "Alaha" (generic for God) or "MarYah" (specific for YHWH)

Hope that helps!
+Shamasha Paul

Thanks for the clarification on the titles of Lord and God. The name of God in the OT is not only YHWH but other specific names are used by Abraham, Moses, Gideon, Isaiah. Yeshua also quoted the name of God as "The God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob" - a long Name which is mistaken as a phrase.

(Gen 22:14) And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovah-jireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the LORD it shall be seen.

(Exo 6:3) And I appeared unto Abraham, unto Isaac, and unto Jacob, by the name of God Almighty, but by my name JEHOVAH was I not known to them.

(Exo 17:15) And Moses built an altar, and called the name of it Jehovah-nissi:

(Jdg 6:24) Then Gideon built an altar there unto the LORD, and called it Jehovah-shalom: unto this day it is yet in Ophrah of the Abi-ezrites.

(Isa 12:2) Behold, God is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for the LORD JEHOVAH is my strength and my song; he also is become my salvation.

Exo 3:13 And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his NAME? what shall I say unto them?
Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Exo 3:15 And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, "The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob", hath sent me unto you: this is my NAME forever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.

1Ki 18:36 And it came to pass at the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice, that Elijah the prophet came near, and said, LORD God of Abraham, Isaac, and of Israel (aka Jacob), let it be known this day that thou art God in Israel, and that I am thy servant, and that I have done all these things at thy word.

Mat 22:32 "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob" God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
Mar 12:26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob"?
Acts 3:13 The "God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers", hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.

Hence YHWH may be known as "The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob".
Reply
#28
Positron, you know the difference between proper names and titles, right? God only has one Name.
+Shamasha Paul bar-Shimun de'Beth-Younan
[Image: sig.jpg]
Reply
#29
Paul Younan Wrote:Positron, you know the difference between proper names and titles, right? God only has one Name.

Good God has one Holy Name YHWH. But what is the verse in Exodus about His Name and not Title? Is it a wrong translation from Greek manuscript?

Exo 3:13 And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his NAME? what shall I say unto them?
Exo 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Exo 3:15 And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, "The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob", hath sent me unto you: this is my NAME forever, and this is my memorial unto all generations. (KJV)

Versus

Peshitta Aramaic Lamsa translation also state "What is His Name?" & This is my Name.

So who is right? Bible is right or you are right - one Name YHWH???
Reply
#30
Positron:
YHVH is the NAME of our eternal Elohim, the Creator of the Heavens and the earth. Elohim/Alaha/God/G-d is His TITLE. "YHVH yireh" is a combination of THE NAME and one of His attributes. It means YHVH provides. So since YHVH provides for his creatures/creation we also refer to this title as Divine Providence. Scripture uses either YHVH alone as the NAME or a combination of YHVH Elohim as NAME-TITLE together. Sometimes the scriptures use the TITLE ELOHIM by itself. All refer to the ONE CREATOR and sustainer of Heaven and earth. The English word LORD is the reverential substitute for the NAME YHVH. It is only out of reverence that the English Bible substitutes LORD for the NAME YHVH. The English word God is substituted for Elohim/Elohey/El or Alaha. Again it's a translation into the common English word God.
In Psalm 150:1 and 6 The first and the last words, the Hebrew word Hallelu-YAH incorporates a shorter form of YHVH. This means Praise-YHVH. This word has universal appeal in virtually all languages. It's incorporated in songs and prose and can be directly translated into "Praise the LORD" or "Praise YHVH" or "Praise The NAME". Halleluyah is equivalent to Barukh HaShem/Bless the NAME. Psalm 150:1 also contains Hallelu-EL.

Shlama,
Stephen
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.dukhrana.com">http://www.dukhrana.com</a><!-- m -->
Reply


Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)