11-01-2013, 06:07 AM
distazo Wrote:Paul Younan Wrote:...but my point is -not- that Yeshu felt forsaken! Again, my point is, he quoted Psalms to notify it was fulfilled!
That's my point, too! Unfortunately, the belief that Yeshu felt "forsaken" is deeply engrained in Christian theology, primarily in the West. And all because the English translation of Psalm 22 imperfectly carries over a single shade of meaning from the original Hebrew word, and the word imagery is not a perfect cognate.
I continue with my point that anyone who would "lose" the reference to Psalm 22:1, may do themselves a favor and actually read it in Hebrew and do a word study on the root a-z-b, and perhaps they would understand Psalm 22 better, than to imagine that David felt "forsaken" by God. (with all that harsh word entails in English/Indo-European)
A person who is actually convinced that God has "forsaken" him, cannot be the author of that same Psalm that concludes with a much different outcome. And a person who is actually convinced that He is "forsaken" by God, does not commit His Spirit to Him at the last breath.
Is not God insulted by the mere accusation that He would "forsake" His annointed servant, let alone His own Son ? Did Job, even, in all his trials make such an accusation ? I am quite positive that no one, ever, has been "forsaken" by God. That is certainly not a pleasant thought, and not something I would wish upon anyone. Not even the worst sinner, counting myself, is "forsaken" by God. What a horribly contradicting thing that would have been to say, or even think, on the Cross. That instead of actually glorifying God at the moment of the Ultimate Triumph, doubt crept in ... as if it were Thomas hanging on the wood.
None of His enemies, when hearing of God "forsaking" Him, thought to say "Listen to His words! We told you He was an imposter!" ???
Language is important, and the meaning of original words as they were conveyed (in all their original imagery) is important. Things change so much in a translation, and so much damage is done. That is why the Jews study the Torah in the original Hebrew and Aramaic, and that's why all Muslims study the Koran in the original Arabic (even if they aren't Arab.)
In Christianity, we lost when Greek came along - and continued to lose each time something else was translated from the Greek (English or whatever.)
Words are important, and they must be understood in their own milieu. They must .... not in a foreign milieu .... their own! Especially because theologians take a word and create dogma from it, and more often than not it's wrong dogma.
Do you know how many times I've been told "well, that was the *precise* moment when *all* the sins of the entire world came upon Him, and God looked away from Him, and ...." ?
All this from what? Conjecture, that's what. Certainly not scripture.
+Shamasha