10-24-2013, 07:20 PM
Thirdwoe stated:
"...you can do this at Dukhrana...".
Thank you. I checked out the Site and it appears that I'll be spending some more time there.
"And... "Why have you departed from me?" is what I believe Jesus, in His humanity said to His Father that day on the Cross..."
Which leads to Distazo, who stated:
"Yeshu said "My father will never leave me"
This statement would be awkward and a mistake if he cried this at last.
Instead, it is a glorious statement: "I fulfilled it!" "
Matthew 5: 17 ? 26: (RSV):
[17] "Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them.
[18] For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.
[19] Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Therefore, both ideas have merit, especially if Thirdwoe's idea of "...in his humanity..." softens the idea of "departing from".
Ecclesiastes 9: 12 (RSV):
[12] For man does not know his time. Like fish which are taken in an evil net, and like birds which are caught in a snare, so the sons of men are snared at an evil time, when it suddenly falls upon them.
Thirdwoe: I do not know the extent of the Lamsa Translation shortcomings, though I have reason to believe you are correct (BTW, I sent an E-Mail to the Lamsa Site "forwarded" E-Mail address. I'm still a bit surprised that the "Official Site" would have "Few" instead of "For" if the correct "For" is in the books. My misteakes I can understand. Lamsa's been around awhile...).
However, the focus is on this verse and the Younan text is very appropriate:
"My God, my god, why have you spared me?..."
If Jesus has escaped - been spared from - Death, then why was he spared FOR THIS?
Mark 14: 48 - 49 (RSV):
[48] And Jesus said to them, "Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me?
[49] Day after day I was with you in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. But let the scriptures be fulfilled."
There is another echo of this in "The Squall":
Mark 6: 48 (in part) - 49 (Moffatt):
[48] ...He would have passed them by,
[49] but when they saw him walking on the sea, they thought it was a ghost and shrieked aloud.
Without too much interpretation here, those in "The Boat" think they are seeing a ghost, perhaps they believe it would have been the ghost of Jesus, though it is stated later that their minds were dull. If Jesus has survived death, then, at the End, it would make sense to say, "Why have you spared me?"
Thus, there is not even a question as to whether God would have forsaken.
CW
"...you can do this at Dukhrana...".
Thank you. I checked out the Site and it appears that I'll be spending some more time there.
"And... "Why have you departed from me?" is what I believe Jesus, in His humanity said to His Father that day on the Cross..."
Which leads to Distazo, who stated:
"Yeshu said "My father will never leave me"
This statement would be awkward and a mistake if he cried this at last.
Instead, it is a glorious statement: "I fulfilled it!" "
Matthew 5: 17 ? 26: (RSV):
[17] "Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them.
[18] For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.
[19] Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
Therefore, both ideas have merit, especially if Thirdwoe's idea of "...in his humanity..." softens the idea of "departing from".
Ecclesiastes 9: 12 (RSV):
[12] For man does not know his time. Like fish which are taken in an evil net, and like birds which are caught in a snare, so the sons of men are snared at an evil time, when it suddenly falls upon them.
Thirdwoe: I do not know the extent of the Lamsa Translation shortcomings, though I have reason to believe you are correct (BTW, I sent an E-Mail to the Lamsa Site "forwarded" E-Mail address. I'm still a bit surprised that the "Official Site" would have "Few" instead of "For" if the correct "For" is in the books. My misteakes I can understand. Lamsa's been around awhile...).
However, the focus is on this verse and the Younan text is very appropriate:
"My God, my god, why have you spared me?..."
If Jesus has escaped - been spared from - Death, then why was he spared FOR THIS?
Mark 14: 48 - 49 (RSV):
[48] And Jesus said to them, "Have you come out as against a robber, with swords and clubs to capture me?
[49] Day after day I was with you in the temple teaching, and you did not seize me. But let the scriptures be fulfilled."
There is another echo of this in "The Squall":
Mark 6: 48 (in part) - 49 (Moffatt):
[48] ...He would have passed them by,
[49] but when they saw him walking on the sea, they thought it was a ghost and shrieked aloud.
Without too much interpretation here, those in "The Boat" think they are seeing a ghost, perhaps they believe it would have been the ghost of Jesus, though it is stated later that their minds were dull. If Jesus has survived death, then, at the End, it would make sense to say, "Why have you spared me?"
Thus, there is not even a question as to whether God would have forsaken.
CW