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To Paul Younan About Human Evil
Since about 1971 when a Jewish friend shared the what Gospel REALLY MEANS with me, my life has had turns and places where I've had the distinct Blessing to be involved with with Jewish folks that believe that Jesus (Yeshua) is the Messiah.

It funny now, Vickie, my Jewish friend, was a friend of my high school girl friend. And she would not have even THOUGHT of herself being "a Hebrew Christian" (that was the terminology in those days of old) AT ALL! Or "a Messianic Jew" (that term had NOT even been invented yet) either!

But we got off on the subject of Messiah by talking about Hal Lindsey's books, and The End Times.

But in the middle of this conversation, she very gently "unleashed" the Good News on me.

And told me how God relates to His people Israel, and how I could be "ingrafted" into that rich and lush Olive Tree.

Now, I say this, because I've done A LOT of thinking about how The Shoah, or The Holocaust, has affected my Jewish Brothers and Sisters.

I would like to think about the concept that there are NO evil people.

This is NOT about ME or my current struggle either. This is about the subject of evil.

Yohannon's Gospel says that the Light touched every person born into this world.

The Quakers who I've hung with some in my past called this (Yohannon's Gospel) "The Quaker Gospel". Because they believe that EVERY HUMAN has a little of this Light.

Now, let's jump back into World War II, for a few minutes.

I've studied the Nazi's and The Shoah intensely, because of my being given the Gift of Messiah by a Jewish person.

These men that ran the death camps, who were Officers, some of them had a rather "decent" home life, and loved their wives and children whom they went home to at night, while during the day they fed The House of Israel into the gas chambers, to the point that smoke belched 24/7 from some places like Auschwitz and Dachau.

Almost all of them that survived to the Nuremburg Trials said that "We were only obeying orders".

I would put it to you that that at the dark heart of the National Socialist Movement, lurked major players (demons) for satan.

I would also put to you that that evil begins a sort "staining process" of the human soul that the longer these men cooperated with it, the easier that it became to do this heinous and barbaric stuff.

Before long, they could go home and act as though nothing was happening, and that they really had no hand in this horrendous evil at all. They played with their own kids while torturing and murdering Jewish children by the hundreds, and finally by the thousands.

At what point does the evil complete it's "staining process" to where it's irrevocable and unchangable?

At what point does a man BECOME EVIL?

I respect that we differ on this question, but the sad fact is that we are at another watershed in history RIGHT NOW, just like we were in 1937 and 1938. With Iran.

The Assyrian Christian FBI Agent who watched over and interrogated Saddam Hussein for MONTHS finally asked him about using WMD's against his own Kurdish population, and Saddam answered that these Kurdish people "Were collateral damage", and in the course of everything, it just really mean't NOTHING.

I respectfully say that you are WRONG about there NOT being evil people in our world.

I have more stories from my life that are too personal to share here in public, but one must EXPERIENCE evil to actually understand it. And I'm NOT speaking about my internet situation, here either.

I was actually blown away when you said that thing about "no evil people" last night.

It reminded me of my wife's Anglican Pastor who is a Universalist.....everyone will be SAVED in the end.

But that's NOT what Rabbi Yeshua taught, IS IT?

Yeshua spent A LOT of time telling us about Gehenna and how to avoid ending up in this place of terrors.

But my bottom line is that human beings can become so "stained" by evil that they lose their very humaness (their LIFE) to the enemy (satan) forever.

But if we look at our recent human history it is pretty bleak, when we choose to live WITHOUT a Saviour, without Our Messiah.

I think that we see examples from the Gospels of demon possessed people that Yeshua freed, these were people who had BECOME EVIL.

But sadly, I don't see the 'Church', or the Yahad, acting in the power that it had in the First Century.

I'm NOT saying that it could not live that Way again, but the chances seem pretty slim to me at this rather late date.

Your own people the Assyrians, have had a Holocaust at the hands of the Turks, and Kurds acting on behalf of the Turks.

I'm sorry my Friend, but on this one, we gotta agree to disagree.

I DO believe that people can become SO FILLED WITH EVIL, as to become completely LOST to ever gaining any REAL hope of spiritual freedom.

Shlama, Your Brother, Albion
Shlama Akhi Albion,

The Church has always held that all human beings are made in the image of God, and because of that they have dignity and worth and value regardless of their individual sin. That includes people like Adolf Hitler, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin-Laden, the Turks and Pol Pot.

Now hear me on this, because human beings are valuable to God we are obliged to treat them as valuable beings, even when we truly believe that their conduct and/or lifestyle are sinful or evil. Never are they themselves evil, to say such a thing we make a mockery of God's creation.

The majority of our beloved Peshitta was written by a murderer, until Meshikha saw fit in His wisdom to change his heart and use him for His glory.

When we pray, it is important to do two things: Firstly, cast our eyes downward, beat upon our chests and cry aloud that we are not worthy. (c.f., Luqa 18:9-14) We need to be more like the Publican.

Secondly, pray, love and do good things for our enemies. For by doing so we reap coals upon their heads (Romans 12:20). This is a Semitic idiom that doesn't mean we are punishing them, but that we are burning their conscience so that they may see the Face of God and turn towards Him who is the source of all Mercy.
Shlama all,

The problem with evil is that the more we focus on it, the more we believe in it and the less we believe in God's power and will to change it.

It is written: "See,this alone I have found, that God made man upright, and they???they have sought out many devices." Eccles. 7:29

God cannot make an evil person, and scripture says he made man upright. We should look at sin as deviation from our own good nature with which God designed us. Someone quoted Isaiah 64. We need to consider Isaiah 53:6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all.
All of us are in the same boat. We have all started out as God's sheep in the fold of God, and we all went astray. We got lost at some point.
We all turned away from God and went our own way. None of us is right to point a finger at another and accuse him or her of being worthless and unsavable.
That smacks of Phariseeism: "Thank you Oh, God, that I am not as other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican" Luke 18:11.

Paul Younan wrote above:
Quote:The majority of our beloved Peshitta was written by a murderer, until Meshikha saw fit in His wisdom to change his heart and use him for His glory.

The apostle Paul said he was the chief of sinners. We need to consider what he said. He had been the worst sinner alive in the world at the time. If anyone was evil (and I don't grant that premise), he was. But our Lord saved him and turned him completely around as an example of his saving grace and power. He became the greatest apostle and servant of God, and wrote most of The Peshitta, as Paul has pointed out. He practically established the Gentile churches with his bare hands by God's grace, and before he died, he wrote:"
Quote:If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

I would not have believed Saul of Tarsus should have been saved, nor could have been saved, if I had known of him and lived at the time. None of the disciples trusted him when they first heard of his conversion. He stood by and held the coats of the men who stoned Stephen to death for his faith and testimony of The Messaih and against their unbelief and hatred toward God, but even Stephen prayed "Lord, lay not this sin to their charge.", even as he died.

If we look at our Savior, we will not think anyone is beyond His salvation. If we think otherwise, we show that we do not know Him or trust in Him.

"If any man see his brother sin a sin which is not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it." 1 John 5:16

I seriously doubt that we know anyone who has sinned the sin unto death, nor do we get to arbitrarily decide what that sin is. We should then pray for the life of those we see sinning, and believe such will receive life from God.

Bryk hu Makhyana d'Alma (Blessed be The Savior of The World),

PS Paul, please check your PM's at <!-- e --><a href=""></a><!-- e -->
I picked up this little piece from:

'Understanding the difficult words of Jesus (New Insights From a Hebraic Perspective)' [First Edition] by David Bivin and Roy Blizzard.

And while I strongly disagree with the New Testament coming to us first IN HEBREW (where is this Original Hebrew New Testament????????????) I definitely agree with what Bivins and Blizzard have to say here: "The idea that pacifism was a part of the teaching of Jesus was popularized in the writings of Tolstoy. Pacifism, however, is not today, nor was it ever, a part of Jewish belief. The Jewish position is summed up in the Talmudic dictum, "If someone comes to kill you, anticipate him and kill him first" (Sanhedrin 72). In other words, it is permissable to kill in order to defend oneself. Can it be, then, that Jesus was the first and only Jew to teach pacifism? It is very unlikely. We know that at least some of Jesus' disciples were armed (Luke 22:38 and Luke 22:50). Add to this fact that, at one point, Jesus even suggested to his disciples that they purchase swords (Luke 22:35-37), and we begin to ask ourselves, did Jesus really believe or teach pacifism? In reality, pacifism is a theological misunderstanding based on several mistranslations of the sayings of Jesus. The first of these mistranslations is in Matthew 5:21 where most English versions of the Bible read, "You shall not kill." This is a quotation of Exodus 20:13. The Hebrew word used there is "murder" (ratzach), and not kill (harag). In Hebrew there is a clear distinction between these two words. The first (ratzach) means premeditated murder while the second (harag) encompasses everything from justiable homicide, manslaughter and accidental killing, to taking the life of an enemy soldier in war. The commandment very precisely prohibits murder, but not the taking of a life in defense of oneself or others.

It is difficult to explain how English translators made this mistake since the Greek language also has separate words for "murder" and "kill," and it is the Greek word for "murder" (not "kill") which is used in Matthew 5:21. Even with no knowledge of Hebrew, the English translators of the New Testament should here have correctly translated "murder," and not "kill."

A second saying of Jesus on which pacifism is based is Matthew 5:39, usually translated, "Do not resist evil," or "Do not resist one who is evil." Could Jesus possibly have said this to his disciples? If he did, his statement contradicts other scriptures such as, "Hate what is evil" (Romans 12:9) and "Resist the devil" (James 4:7).

Again, Hebrew provides the answer. When we translate this verse back into Hebrew, we see that Jesus was not creating a new saying, but quoting a well-known Old Testament proverb. This proverb appears, with slight variations, in Psalm 37:1, 8, and Proverbs 24:19. In modern English we would translate this maxim: "Don't compete with evildoers." In other words, do not try to rival or vie with a neighbor who has wronged you. Jesus is not teaching that one should lie down in the face of evil or submit to evil; rather, he is teaching that we should forego trying to "get back at," or take revenge on a quarrelsome neighbor. As Proverbs 24:29 says, "Do not say, 'I will do to him as he has done to me, I will pay the man back for what he has done'."

Jesus is expressing an important principle which applies to our relationships with friends and neighbors. It does not apply when we are confronted with a murderer, rapist, or like person of violence; nor when we are facing the enemy on the field of battle. Jesus is not talkng about how to deal with violence. He is talking about the fundamentals of brotherly relationships, about how to relate to our neighbor. If, for instance, a neighbor dumps a pail of garbage on our lawn, we are not to retaliate by dumping two pails on his lawn. If someone cuts in front of us in traffic, we are not to try to catch up and run him off the road. Wanting to "get even" is, of course, a natural response; however, it is not our responsibility to punish our neighbor for his action. That responsibility is God's. We are to respond to our neighbor in a way that will disarm and shame him for his actions. Proverbs 25:21 says: "If your enemy is hungry, give him bread to eat, and if he is thirsty, give him water to drink. In so doing you heap red-hot coals on his head, and the Lord will reward you."

Once we discover how to correctly translate Matthew 5:39, we can correctly understand the verses which follow. Each verse is an illustration of how we react to a hostile neighbor. If, for example (Matthew 5:39), a friend insults and embarrasses us by slapping us on the cheek, we are not to slap him back, but instead offer our other cheek. This, by the way, is probably the best known of all the sayings of Jesus. It is also another of the sayings on which pacifism is based. Properly understood, however, it has nothing to do with battlefield situations, defending oneself against a murderer, or resisting evil. It is an illustration of how to deal with an angry neighbor, a "personal enemy." Mistranslation of Matthew 5:39 has created a theological contradiction. But, when this saying is understood Hebraically, rather than contradict, it harmonizes beautifully with the rest of Scripture. Our response to evil does have to be resistance! It is morally wrong to tolerate evil. Our response to a "hot-headed" neighbor, on the other hand, must be entirely different. His anger will only be temporary if we respond in a biblical manner: "See that none of you pays back evil with evil; instead, always try to do good to each other and all people" (I Thessalonians 5:15); "Do not repay evil with evil or curses with curses; but with blessings. Bless in return--that is what you have been called to do--so that you may inherit a blessing (I Peter 3:9); "Bless those who persecute you. Bless them. Do not curse them. Do not pay anyone back with evil for evil....if it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live peacably with everyone. Beloved, do not take revenge, but leave that to the wrath of God" (Romans 12:14 and 17-19). The responsibility of the godly person is to defuse a potentially devisive situation by "turning away wrath." We are not to seek revenge. If a neighbor or friend has wronged us and is in need of punishment, God is the only one who can administer it properly: "Do not say, 'I will repay the evil deed in kind'. "Trust in the Lord. He will save you." [i.e., He will take care of it] (Proverbs 20:22). Our responsibility is not to react, not to respond in kind to a belligerent neighbor. We are not to "be overcome by evil" but to "overcome evil with good" (Romans 12:21).

Now, The Religious Society Friends (The Quakers), The Mennonites, The Amish (all Orders), The Church of the Brethren and The Church of God (Seventh Day), and many other various Christian Pacificist Churches would very strongly condemn the above.

But the fact is, is that Yeshua NEVER told anyone that they should NOT be a soldier, or that they should LEAVE the military.

He did in fact, advise His Disciples to BUY SWORDS, and when Shimun Keepa said that we have two swords, Yeshua responded by saying that that should be enough.

I see NOTHING to conflict with military service, and being a Disciple of Yeshua at the same time.

It was Bivins and Blizzard that brought this kind of unbalanced view that seems to come from shoddy Biblical scholarship, of what Messiah said....home to me, so that I could really understand it.

And correct it in my own studies.

In modern Israel, among Messianic Jewish Believers, that is no wall at all between serving in the IDF (Israeli Defense Forces) and being a strong Messianic Believer in Yeshua.

As you see in this very inspiring clip from Israeli News:

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I may have more to say about this subject tomorrow, after I sleep on it, and pray more about it.

Till then.....

Shlama in Yeshua, Albion

Read this first:

'A Weekend With Ohio Conservative Friends'

This past weekend I traveled to Barnesville,Ohio to 'The Wider Gathering of Conservative Friends.'

I met people that before I had only known from their writings; Terry Wallace (from the New Foundation Fellowship), Arthur Berk, Seth Hinshaw, Nancy Hawkins, and Jack and Susan Smith, to name just a few.

I had never attended a gathering of Ohio Conservative Friends before, but I had heard many times about their tenderness and their Christ Centered focus.

Everything that I had heard was true.

I met Conservative Friends there from Ohio, Pennsylvania, Indiana, Illinois, Iowa, Texas, California, New York, Georgia, West Virginia, and Virginia, and Britian and India, as well!

The silent waiting upon the Lord meetings were absolutely the best times of vocal worship that I had ever shared with any other Quakers anywhere in the U.S.

On seventh day evening Jack Smith (with the help of his children) gave a really well done presentation on 'The Lamb's War'.

It was awesome!

We had good weather the whole time, and sitting inside the 18th century hand built (by olden Friends) Still Water Meeting House was a treat in itself.

The doors were opened to the outside, and as Still Water is out in the country, which brought nature into our worship as well.

Everyone had communal meals together at Olney School which is also on the grounds, and not so far away from Still Water Meeting House.

This too was quite a special feeling, of sharing meals with people who share so much of the same kind of Quakerism.

Everyone was exceptionally kind to everyone else and 'Plain Language' abounded.

I've never heard so many "Thee's" and "Thou's", and "Thy", as I heard this past weekend. :-)

About 3/4 of the folks there were 'Plain Dressers', and several of the women looked as though they had just walked directly out of 'The Presence in the midst' painting. It was truly amazing.

It gave me alot of thought over the way that most of us dress, and the counter-point to that, of 'Plain Dressing'.

I enjoyed myself immensely, and felt right at home, and found the language of Plainess really quite lovely!

I'll go back in two years for sure, for the next meeting of scattered Conservative Friends, and in the mean time, I'm considering trying to start a Christ Centered meeting here in our home town of Mason City, Iowa (if it be the Lord's leading.....which I feel that it is).

I especially want to thank Terry Wallace and the New Foundation Fellowship and The George Fox Fund for their very kind offer of a scholarship to help defray my traveling costs.

This was a simply wonderful Meeting that I will carry in my soul and spirit for a very long time, and in fact, I will consider Ohio Conservative Friends (at Barnesville)to be my 'spiritual home', from this point, onward.

In the Light of Christ,

Greying Quaker/Albion Guppy

First, it's apparent to me that you've never been involved in a war, or combat, have you?

Most of what I wrote was taken (which I THOUGHT that I was clear about) from David Bivins and Roy Blizzard's book.

75% of that post, probably.

It's apparent that you know nothing about Friends (Quakers) either.

Most American Quakers are basically PAGAN and believe in this vague and indescrible "Inner Light".

They LAUGH at Conservative Friends and call us "Jesus Freaks".

Here in our state of Iowa, Conservative Friends from Ohio and North Carolina started the original Friends Meetings back in the 18th Century.

Almost ALL Iowa Friends (except ONE PERSON in Southern Iowa) are Liberal to the MAX.

They definately ARE NOT Believers in Christ Jesus. But, for all intents and purposes, they are PAGAN.

Now onward through the fog.......I NEVER said that Yeshua was trying to start ANY kind of "jihad", and arm his followers with machetes!

Whattttttt? Where does THIS even COME FROM?

I THOUGHT that the video from Israel was a perfect idea of what I was trying to illustrate, that these young men and women who were a part of the IDF (Israeli Defense Forces) and were also strong Believers in Yeshua.

Being ONE THING, does NOT negate the OTHER!

I am a Gentile. But I believe in a Jewish Saviour, who I personally Believe is STILL Jewish till this moment.

If any quote that Bivins or Blizzard used, upset you, then I'm sorry. But those words WERE NOT MINE, BUT THEIRS.

Now, I mentioned a conversation from 1971 that Hal Lindsey's book 'The Late Great Planet Earth' was a part of......this was mentioned in PASSING.

I AM NOT a follower of Hal Lindsey IN ANY WAY. But I mentioned Hal Lindsey as a part of a conversation that I had with Vickie Simon that helped me come to Faith, to Believe in Messiah Yeshua. Do you UNDERSTAND THIS??

This conversation was about The End of Days. Yes, we talked about the End Times in 1971 TOO!

Wow, that my experience of Conversion BOTHERS YOU, that just blows me away! I don't know HOW to respond to THAT!


Do I agree with Jewish colloborators with the Romans in 70 AD?

Or IN ANY WAY support their warped Jewish spirituality?

NO, of course NOT!

And this mention of Islam, amd Mohammed.

I hate to be crude, but my middle finger up to Islam!

And this isn't from Paul Younan, or, it's from Albion Guppy!

Remember the World Trade Center! We will NEVER forget!

I'm done.

Shlama, Albion

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