Peshitta Forum
Nicodemus again...Maybe - Printable Version

+- Peshitta Forum (
+-- Forum: New Testament (
+--- Forum: Aramaic Primacy Forum (
+--- Thread: Nicodemus again...Maybe (/showthread.php?tid=3362)

Nicodemus again...Maybe - Charles Wilson - 09-17-2014

Hello everyone-

1. I'm off the Reservation a bit. I've been studying Howard Teeple, certified Greekie, who has attempted to unpack John by analyzing Greek articles in front of (or not...) names. I'm gonna try to summarize Teeple in a future Post. The Meta-Story of how Aramaic Properties would have been translated into Greek and then would have had to be re-translated back into Aramaic to get to the Aramaic NT is interesting and best left to PY and those who know. Teeple is interesting. More later.

2. Teeple is not why I'm Posting today. I was looking at his translations of John 8 last night and something connected concerning Nicodemus again. Please see previous Posts on Nicodemus and "You must be born again..." as an idiom, an idiom with roots that went back 1000 years prior to NT times to Sumer. The first appearance of the word "Freedom" is "Amargi" and it is literally "Return to the Mother". Nicodemus is a Pharisee and a "Ruler of the Jews". Now, there is another puzzle concerning "You must be born from above" but I'm WAAAAY out of my league on this point. The important thing is that Nicodemus understands the words but not the intent, a clue that we are in fact dealing with an idiom.

3. One of the meanings of amargi was, in the Akkadian, manumission of slaves and the John 8 passage may be based on this idea. It's easy to Cut and Paste John into a variety of meanings and infer Sources from the Cut and Paste job (I've done this with John 11 and 12...) but there may be something to this one:

4. John 8: 31 - 36 (RSV):

[31] Jesus then said to the Jews who had believed in him, "If you continue in my word, you are truly my disciples,
[32] and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free."
[33] They answered him, "We are descendants of Abraham, and have never been in bondage to any one. How is it that you say, `You will be made free'?"
[34] Jesus answered them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, every one who commits sin is a slave to sin.
[35] The slave does not continue in the house for ever; the son continues for ever.
[36] So if the Son makes you free, you will be free indeed.

It may or may not be helpful to associate Nicodemus with this passage at this point. Sorta' do your own Cut and Paste. However, note the intentionality of the passage:
" will know the truth and the truth will make you free...". As if to say, "...the truth will make you return-to-the-mother-as-in-freed-from-slavery..."

Notice!: "...We are descendants of Abraham, and have never been in bondage to any one..." (!!!)

"...How is it that you say, `You will be made free'?". That's the Intentionality of the phrase!!!

Here's where the tie-in to Nicodemus comes in. Jesus states, "...I say to you, every one who commits sin is a slave to sin...".

John 3: 3 - 4 (RSV):

[3] Jesus answered him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God."
[4] Nicode'mus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?"

You must be born again, as in "You must be free", as in "You must be freed from your slavery", as in, "You must return to the mother". Nicodemus understands the words but not the meaning. "The Jews" hear that they are "Slaves to sin and must be freed from their slavery..." Again, they understand the words but not the intentionality of the phrase.

"The slave does not continue in the house for ever..."

He is freed and he "Returns to the Mother". This is extremely sophisticated Etymology. I mean *Extremely* sophisticated Etymology.


PS Edit: When I imply that there is a "Cut and Paste" job available, I mean that IF the use of "...Born Again..." is correct and occurs in both Stories, either there are 2 Stories or the Nicodemus Story has been separated and there is a Unified Story that declares something about being Freed from Sin using a VERY old phrase. Any examination of these ideas are interesting to me.